Post by classic rock revival on Mar 19, 2024 12:17:49 GMT -6
Classic Rock Revival
Pat Liston Interview
"The Pride of St. Louis," Mama's Pride was formed in 1972 by brothers Pat and Danny Liston. After playing a couple of years on the local scene, Mama’s Pride signed a record deal with Atco/Atlantic Records in 1975 and recorded their self-titled debut album. The band spent the following couple years on the road playing with a variety of bands from the Charlie Daniels Band to The Outlaws, and many others.
In 1977 Mama’s Pride was back in the studio and released their follow-up album, "Uptown and Lowdown". The album did fairly well and songs like “She’s a Stranger to Me Now” and “Merry-Go-Round” gained airplay on radio. However, Atco Records didn't renew their contract after their second album, but they still continued to perform as Mama’s Pride until 1982 when they disbanded.
In 1987 Mama’s Pride got together again and played a reunion show which led them to doing more gigs and a new album, "Guard Your Heart", in 1992. Mama’s Pride continues to perform live a couple times a year in their hometown, of St. Louis, MO.
JIM: I'd like to thank you for agreeing to do this interview for my 'Classic Rock Revival' forum. I'm a longtime fan of the first two Mama's Pride albums and recently re-discovered the band to find out there are now a total of four Mama's Pride albums in addition to solo CD's you've released over the years. Can you tell me a bit about your current band and most recent solo CD?
PAT: I play solo around town but periodically put a band together for a concert. As you said, I have solo CDs, I just released my 4th in December 2023, they are:
1. Blue Mist (2003)
2. Dreamer (2008)
3. Wild At Heart (2013)
4. Changes (2023)
Pat Liston Website
The most recent CD “Changes” was actually a long time coming Lots of starts and stops. Mostly technical issues. These days a song is rarely done all at once in a single studio, like the old days. It was primarily recorded at Casa Del Torretta Studios with several overdubs done at Fahrenheit Studio both in St. Louis. Some of the musicians did overdubs in their home studios and sent me the tracks. I was having a problem getting the mix I wanted locally so I brought in longtime friend and Grammy award winning producer, Jim Gaines, to do the final mix for me. The graphic design, concept, and photography were done by Kieth Hempen and my wife Dawn Liston. The songs are an eclectic blend of styles. I do songs with just me and a guitar, to a funk song with full band and horn section, to a New Orleans style song reminiscent of Leon Redbone.
The funk song came about purely by accident. I bought a 2007 Chrysler van to haul equipment. It had a “cassette” player!! So, I looked in some old drawers and found some cassettes I had made from the 90s. There were original versions of songs that I had later recorded, some that I’d never recorded, it was fun! Then this funk song came on called “You Can’t Live Your Life Without God”, I’d completely forgotten about it. It had sampled horns on it that I’d arranged at the time. I sent a copy to my brother, and he said “Dude, you HAVE to put this on the new CD”!! I was in the process of doing the 4th CD. It was nothing like the other songs but… I’m my own boss in this so… I put it on.
Once I had my 11 songs recorded and had garnered Jim Gaines to mix, I was finally ready. Three songs into the mix Jim had to go into the hospital for surgery. He was out for a while but was adamant that he wanted to be the one to finish it. So, again, I waited but, c’mon, it’s Jim Gaines!! While waiting, I started writing more songs. I wrote one that I felt needed to be on the CD. It was called “Differently The Same”. I heard a sousaphone on it and New Orleans brass and percussion. I contacted my friends “The Funky Butt Brass Band” because it was totally in their wheelhouse! So, the CD ended up with 12 songs. I look forward to doing a concert with the Pat Liston Band which would basically be the guys I recorded the CD with, maybe next spring?
JIM: In addition to performing with your solo band, Mama's Pride has also still been doing quite a few shows over the last several years mostly in the St. Louis area. Is the Pat Liston Band a continuation of Mama's Pride or are they two completely different bands?
PAT: No, Mama’s Pride is still going to play with remaining members. The Pat Liston Band is different. I do a few of my more popular songs that I wrote and sang with Mama’s Pride, but primarily do songs from my solo CDs. The biggest difference ion personnel is, I use a Uilleann piper on the show because some of my songs on my solo CDs has Irish pipes on them. But some of the musicians are guys I use in the Mama’s Pride band.
JIM: Mama's Pride signed a record deal with Atco/Atlantic Records in the mid-70's and managed to get Arif Mardin to produce your debut album. Arif Mardin was a very hot producer at that time, who worked with a number of artists and produced a number of hits across many different styles of music, including rock, jazz, soul, and country. How did Arif Mardin come to produce Mama's Pride's debut album? How was he to work with, did you enjoy working with him?
PAT: Ahmet Ertegun signed us to Atco/Atlantic. Arif was one of their top producers there. Ahmet chose him for the project. Arif was class personified. He was an absolute pleasure to work with.
One of the things he did was put a song on the album that we had not planned on even recording. The song was “Young & Free”. We were taking a short break, and I was in the studio alone playing guitar by myself. I was playing and singing “Young & Free”. What I didn’t know was, he was standing right behind me. Suddenly a voice said (in that great Turkish accent) “What is that song”? I told him what it was and that it was one of mine. He said, “That will be on the album”. I said “Oh, no, we’ve never even worked it out as a band”. Then he said, “That was not a question, Pat, that “will” be on the album, we’ll work it out, I am a producer, it’s what I do”, then he smiled. He brought an element to that song I didn’t think was possible and brought out something in the band I didn’t know we had”.
One of the great things about working with Arif were his “Visitors”. Every group he ever produced loved him and many of them came in to just say hi while we were recording, which was cool with us. The Bee Gees, Average White Band, Dave Mason, even Eric Clapton, AND he came with Patti Boyd!!!
Towards the end we were doing individual overdubs. Most of us were in the lobby playing a pinball machine they had there, Tom Dowd came and hung out!!! I played pinball with TOM DOWD!!! He was a great guy, he took the whole band (including road crew) out to a nice restaurant one night and paid for it. When we went to New York we also met Jerry Wexler.
Oh, and a side note, we stayed at 461 Ocean Blvd!! Everybody thought that was Eric Clapton’s house!! LOL!! It actually was a REALLY cool band house for people that recorded at Criteria Studios. All four Beatles (individually) stayed there, The Eagles, Led Zeppelin, Rod Stewart, Bee Gees, etc. Girls would periodically knock at the door asking if “Eric” was home LOL!! I had the master bedroom, and I barely slept the first night thinking “My God, every Beatle probably slept in this bed”!! Pretty cool for a bunch of guys from South St. Louis.
JIM: Yeah, I can see where it would be pretty cool to have a host of famous musicians stop by the studio you were recording your debut album in to visit with your producer, in fact I'd call that a real morale booster! Speaking of other famous musicians is it true Ronnie Van Zant expressed an interest in producing Mama's Pride's third album? Also, I heard Gregg Allman hired Mama's Pride to be his backing band on his 1978 solo tour, did that actually happen?
PAT: We opened for Lynyrd Skynyrd on July 8th, 1977, in Springfield, MO. I talked with Ronnie at length after the show. We sat on a freight case together cross-legged while he graciously signed dozens of autographs for fans. He was really excited about producing us.
He said he didn’t feel we were southern rock. He thought we had incredible vocals and harmonies, and that should be the emphasis. Hell, I knew that the first time Max, Danny, and I sang. That’s why we put the band together in the first place. Finally, someone with clout got it too.
We went back to the dressing room where the rest of the band was. He said he wanted us to do their Winter Tour, which would have solidified our success! Ronnie told me, “I want you and your brother with me 24/7. You two are the principal writers.” I kiddingly said, “Can we start tomorrow?” He was a stand-up guy. He said there were already groups slotted to open shows through October. He didn’t want to bump anyone off these shows and put them out of work. But it was okay. We were gonna tour with Lynyrd Skynyrd! Then October came and everything changed. But had we been on tour with them then, like I wanted, Danny and I would have been on that plane.
In 1978 we hooked up with Gregg Allman in Daytona Beach at a place called The Wreck Bar. He sat in with us for about an hour. At that point David Cloud (our road manager) and myself made arrangements to talk to him the following day. We told him we could be his opening act (as Mama’s Pride) and his band to headline as the Gregg Allman Band. We had sound & lights, David would book it and we’d give him 50% of the profit. He was up for it. He’d just left Cher and had not performed in a while. We ended up doing over 20 concert dates with him. He told me he’d never had that much fun on the road. We enjoyed what we did, after shows we’d all go to someone’s motel room and sit around laughing and singing. He loved singing harmonies with us. We remained friends until his passing.
JIM: Mama's Pride's first two albums did pretty well and got radio airplay on AOR stations. "Blue Mist", became your signature song that remains a classic today and "In The Morning", became a pretty popular tune on radio too. The second album, "Uptown And Lowdown", was a good follow up album that seemed to keep the momentum going but the third album was a longtime coming, it was 1992 before "Guard Your Heart", saw the light of day. Why the long wait?
PAT: Well, when Ronnie Van Zant died our hopes of a third LP with Atlantic Records did too and we were dropped from the label. We had a slight burst with Gregg Allman and were talking about doing an album together with another label with him (his contract was up), but Phil Walden (Capricorn) was going to have none of that so, he managed to get the ABB back together. Gregg even told my brother once that the reason the ABB was reformed was because Phil was afraid, he’d lose Gregg to us and another label. So, basically, because of us the ABB got back together… flattering but didn’t do much for us. After that we just played large clubs around the St. Louis area until my departure from the band in January of 1982. Not long after, Mama’s Pride, as a band, broke up. I was married and had children and was wanting to focus on that.
We did a couple of reunion concerts that sold-out, but it was always somewhat depressing because we weren’t really a band anymore and didn’t have new material. I wrote very few songs during my hiatus. I moved my family to Los Angeles in 1985 but we only lasted about a year there. It was just too expensive… but I wrote several songs during that time and had a bit part in a Bruce Willis movie that was kind of cool.
My brother hooked up with some people that wanted to put together financing for a new Mama’s Pride CD. I really wanted nothing to do with it. I was used to doing the bigger part of the writing and most of the CD was Danny’s music with me being the “singer”. There was 11 songs on the CD. They used two of my old songs, “Maybe” and “Sail On” that we’d done several recordings of years before and one new one that I’d written in L.A. called “Que linda”. I had more songs but there were no more slots left. It was a great CD and Danny’s songs were superb, but I had NO desire to be a “lead singer” up front with no instrument. I was a musician!! Guard Your Heart sold ok and we did get the opportunity to work with Grammy winning producer Jim Gaines…. who is still a friend (he mixed my most recent CD “Changes"). We played around town for about a year, but nothing was happening. Things had changed, all the members had moved on and had their own local projects… so, we, once again, disbanded and went our separate ways.
JIM: You included a remake of Blue Mist on your first solo CD that was also the CD's title. It's a more melodic-melancholy version than Mama's Pride's, can you tell me a bit about that period, your CD and decision to remake Blue Mist the way you did?
PAT: After leaving Mama’s Pride in 1982 I didn’t write many songs. We got back together in ’92 for the “Guard Your Heart” CD. Even though I really didn’t want to do that project, (I was glad, later, that I did) it was the impetus to get me back writing. I went on a writing tirade from ’95 to ’97. Around 2001 I started researching how to do a CD yourself. Around 2002 I chose the songs I wanted to record. Ironically, my brother Danny was also doing a CD project. He was the one that suggested I put a quasi-acoustic version of Blue Mist on it. He felt it would help boost sales. In the interim, we booked a Mama’s Pride concert at the Pageant. This was to be the first time in 10 years that we played together. I decided that, if I was going to do a version of Blue Mist, why not just use Blue Mist as the title track. Scott Nienhaus played guitar on the newer version and did a stellar job. Danny actually liked the 2003 version of Blue Mist better. He said it was more the way the song was originally written.
JIM: Another one of your CD's I wanted to ask you about is the one that you and your brother Danny released in 2018, The Liston Brothers. It's a really good CD, I especially like "Solitary Man" and "Another Rock and Roll Poet." Do you currently perform either one of those songs in your current live shows and how did The Liston Brothers CD come about?
PAT: We were approached by a financial backer named Kevin Coe who, basically, wanted us to do a CD together. He was willing to finance the whole thing to see it become a reality. We went to Memphis and recorded it with Pete Mathews producing it. We have done “Solitary Man” in concert. I’ve done “Rock n roll poet” on my solo gigs.
JIM: You mentioned earlier that you're doing solo shows now predominantly in the St. Louis area. How's that going? Have you considered doing shows outside of St. Louis, going on the road so to speak?
PAT: Yeah, St. Louis and the Metro East. The concerts (1 or 2 a year) are the big money, but the solo stuff pays the regular bills. My wife books me 1-3 times a week. Sometimes private house concerts too. Mama’s Pride sold records all over the world but not in large quantities. At my age the gigs would have to pay a lot to get me out on the road again and there probably isn’t a market out there, but never say never.
JIM: St. Louis used to be a great rock and roll town that had a lot of really great clubs that are long gone now. Mississippi Nights, Night Moves out in Overland and Stages in Granite City. What is your opinion of the current music scene in St. Louis today? Is it as thriving as it used to be?
PAT: The music scene now is very different from the old days. There was a ton of really cool places, like the ones you mentioned. Things change, people change. There’s no radio anymore, a single station like KSHE had a huge listening audience but today, everything is very diluted. That directly affects the “club” scene. Social media has also played a large roll in people going out.
JIM: Being a musician and a native St. Louisian, did you ever get a chance to meet Chuck Berry? Ken Hensley of Uriah Heep also lived in St. Louis for a while in the mid to late 80's. He had stopped touring and performing for a while and took a 9 to 5 job at St. Louis Music Company. He set up their artist endorsement program and ran their export department. Did you ever run into Ken in his St. Louis days?
PAT: I was playing with a local Motown style band called The Soulful Illusions. We were booked to play at Chuck’s farm out in Wentzville. Chuck rarely showed up for these things and was often out of town, so I had no expectations of seeing him. When I got there, I was unloading my gear and a man walked up in a worker-style jumpsuit and offered to help me… obviously a groundskeeper. He grabbed my Fender Concert Amp like it was a toy. I thought “No wonder Chuck hired this guy”! I thanked him when we went inside and he said “No problem” and walked away.
The” Soulful” had four singers up front that would’ve rivaled the Temptations… it was a great band, headed up by the late great Rudy Coleman. About halfway through the 2nd set Rudy turned to me and said, “Chuck Berry is going to sit in… do NOT try and do any solo work, just keep the rhythm”. I said “Absolutely”!!! Hell, I’d have played the kazoo… I was just thrilled that I was going to get to play onstage with him!! Rudy introduced him and, yep… the “groundskeeper!! He did 2 or 3 songs, and we finished the set. I was so embarrassed that I hadn’t recognized him that I didn’t say anything to him. He disappeared anyway, which was fine with me…. I’m not sure what I could’ve said that wouldn’t have sounded stupid.… but his kindness to me always stuck with me.
Ken Hensley and I were good friends. I even played with him in a quasi-Christian band called “Visible Faith”.
JIM: You and Ken Hensley were good friends! That's really cool!! Do you have a story, any fond memories of Ken you could share?
PAT: Ken did an old Robert Johnson song called “Hellhound on my trail” on a 1995 album called “Rattlesnake guitar: The music of Peter Green”. He invited me to play dobro style slide guitar on the song with him as a sort of, duo thing. When it was released, Ken had taken credit for playing everything, including slide guitar LOL... that was Ken.
JIM: A lot of great music has come out of St. Louis, the legendary, Chuck Berry, Head East, Pavlov's Dog, but it was Mama's Pride that was christened 'The Pride of St. Louis'! How did you guys get that prestigious title?
PAT: The term “Pride of St. Louis” came from an old friend of ours named Don McLaughlin. He’d made bumper stickers that said “Mama’s Pride… the pride of St. Louis” and gave them out for free, the monicker stuck. So, Don started it, and the fans went with it!! It was a fan-based thing!! We’re still good friends with Don.
4/9/24